Different Rules?
On the back of my recent How To Operate a Bloke post, I received several emails (from blokes and chicks) requesting that I write a similar post about the female of the species. My response to those requests is (1) as if I’d know how and (2) what do you think I am, a complete idiot? Don’t answer that. You do know there are different rules between the sexes right? For example, if I make fun of a man, that’s entertainment. A comparable post about a woman; disgusting and sexist. If I was to call the typical bloke a big, dumb, penis-driven, emotionally inept, Neanderthal with the I.Q. of a wombat, that would be socially acceptable; if not downright hilarious. The equivalent comment about a woman would be considered insensitive and derogatory; journalistic suicide even… craig-who-dot-com?
Voluptuous? Full-figured? Curvy?
Okay, just to be clear – making fun of blokes; funny. Making fun of chicks; not funny. Especially if in some moment of cerebral meltdown, you choose to refer to their bodies. Calling a fat guy fat; fine. Calling a fat woman fat; not fine. Even if she’s gigantic. “Wow, isn’t she…. er… voluptuous?” Better still, say nothing. Even if you think you’re saying the right thing, it won’t be.
You Sexist Pig…
A few months ago here in the thriving metropolis of Melbourne, we hosted the Australian Tennis Open and there was something of an uproar because a (male) commentator suggested that one of the female tennis players might be carrying more body-fat than is desirable for an elite athlete. Not a completely unreasonable insight or observation. Naturally he was labelled a sexist pig and there was absolutely no chance that his opinion might in any way be worth considering. On the other hand, if she (the player) had been a he, the media would not have been remotely interested in the comments and there would have been no public outcry. In fact, there would have been no story, no media attention and the remarks would have gone un-noticed. Nobody would be talking about the out-of-shape male tennis player and nobody would be discussing sexism in sport because the remark was about a bloke – and it’s okay to say whatever we want about male bodies. Funny even. But not female bodies. As an exercise scientist and someone who has worked with thousands of bodies for nearly three decades, to me the comment (about the female tennis player) had nothing to do with gender, sexism or discrimination but some people chose to make it about that. It had to do with the athlete’s body-fat percentage and her level of conditioning for her sport. It seems that some people look for a reason to get offended.
What if She was a He?
If a sports commentator talks about how out-of-shape a male athlete appears – and they do often – nobody even bats an eyelid because they are merely pointing out the obvious. In the AFL (Aussie Rules) grand final last year there was a player by the name of Stuart Dew (pictured below) who put in a great performance. He is an athlete who took a year off the game and then was drafted by the eventual premiers, Hawthorn. Take a look at an extract from the Australian newspaper (below), the day after the game. By the way, the stuff in orange is the actual title of the article. Could you imagine a newspaper article with the title “The fat Woman is singing….”?
“The fat man is singing as project Dew tips scales in September” (The Australian, Sept. 29, 2008)
FOR men everywhere who are a few kilograms past their prime, Stuart Dew is the new cult hero. A year ago, he weighed 20kg more than he did during Saturday’s grand final, and without being rude, he could still shed a few. But the spare tyre he carried around the MCG did not stop him being one of the stand-outs in Hawthorn’s stunning premiership, with his desperate tackling and two goals late in the third quarter helping to turn the match on its head. As Hawthorn great Robert DiPierdomenico quipped during yesterday’s post-match celebrations at Glenferrie Oval: “It was one for the fat man, eh! How good is that? You don’t have to be an athlete to play this game.”
To my knowledge, not one person complained about the above article (or it’s title). Could it be because his name is Stuart, not Sarah?
Houston… We Have a Footballer
Last Saturday night (April 11, 2009) I was watching a football show here in Melbourne and one of the members of the panel described Dew as the only AFL player who could be seen from outer space. When the comment was made, the only response from the rest of the panel was laughter. If I was Stuart Dew I don’t think I would be personally devastated by the comments but could you imagine the public outcry and backlash if a sports commentator made comparable public comments about one of our elite female athletes? My guess is that he/she would be sacked. There’s a lot of distance between laughter and sacking isn’t there?
The No-Penis Policy
Then there’s the well-known chain of female-only gyms here in the Land Down Under. One of their recent advertising campaigns involved gigantic billboards emblazoned with the words “No Toms, no Harrys and definitely no Dicks”. Personally, I am not offended in the least by their marketing strategy (it takes a lot), in fact I found the campaign kind of amusing and clever. But that’s me. However, I wonder what the response might have been if I decided to promote my chain of bloke-only gyms with an advertising campaign that highlighted the absence of female genitalia in my centres? Probably not good I’m guessing.
What Writing Plan?
I’m not really sure how this article came to be – I didn’t actually plan it – as such. I was just sitting here at my computer thinking about this stuff. I do that. Sometimes (okay, most of the time) I just start writing and something like this is the result. So I guess there’s no major personal development message and no life-changing insight or philosophical brain food for you today; just me thinking out loud and wondering what your thoughts on this topic might be?
Although it is kinda interesting don’tcha think?
Let me know your thoughts and do your best to keep it clean, intelligent, relevant and constructive.
Enjoy your day Rockstars.
If you’re not sure how to leave a comment, click here. Yep, even you chronic Lurkers.
P.S. Also, let me know if you managed to abstain from arguing for twenty four hours (off the back of yesterday’s post).
Ciao x
{ 42 comments… read them below or add one }
Hi Craig,
I was actually listening to you discuss this on your radio gig last night (Tues)Loved it!!! People need to get over themselves and get less precious about some things. Political correctness has gone mad. God forbid we might offend anyone. People like Dew and Delaqua (sp) are in the public eye and because of that are open to scrutiny. Did anyone ask either of them if they were offended by the remarks?? Fun post!!! thanks
OOh and I have not had an argument at all today (not even with the traffic lol)….1 day down, 27 to go…woohoo!!!
hugs
Chelle xxx
Well darnit Craig !!! I just typed a whole heap of stuff and clicked to publish, and it vanished into thin air ! So…. wot I sed wuz…. firstly, I was so late commenting on yesterday’s post that I’m in time for today’s !
And… I agree with you that some people look for reasons to be offended, and find them even if there are none.
And as far as avoiding arguments… since I only read that post an hour or so ago, I can only legitimately claim an hour, although I don’t seem to recall any arguments in the past 24. Could be due to Old Timer’s…….??!!
{{Hug}} Tina
I agree with a lot of what you’re saying, Craig. It’s a very tough subject for a guy to address without getting his head knocked off.
It’s a tricky subject, because in my opinion, I want to be respected like the blokes for my performance. But I also want to be considered beautiful. When I was training hard in the fall with weights, a male friend of mine expressed his concern that I would turn masculine. His comments didn’t stop me. And I didn’t turn into a man. But c’mon…
I am guessing this is because in many societies we’ve been conditioned to judge a man by his money and power, and a woman by her beauty. So by criticizing a man’s body, you are just saying something that’s funny but not that relevent, but by criticizing a woman’s body, you are attacking her very own identity (even if she doesn’t feel that way, somebody else will).
Yeah, I think you better write it under a female name as a guest post.
Or, maybe as an interview with a woman?????????
I can see the comments coming from all the way in Chicago.
(no arguments for 24 hours)
I think Kelvin is on the money. I mean, look how many crusty, old, ugly (but rich) men get their hands on pretty young women? Ugh. And just look at magazines – men’s mags are all full of pics of beautiful women, while women’s mags are full of pics of … yep, beautiful women!
Personally, I hate the whole PC thing. Can’t stand it when women want “special consideration”. Gentlemen’s only clubs are considered offensive and outdated, yet women’s only clubs are modern and a brilliant idea .. ?? Besides, who wants to work out at a gym where there are no muscly men to check out????
I would have loved to see you write the equivalent article on How To Operate A Woman, Craig. A man’s take on it. I think it would have been hilarious.
Suz (Sydney)
Oh Craig. Stop bleating about the injusticeses of the world!
So you can’t rib me for being a fat scrag? Boo hoo poppet.
You can wee standing up in a field and you don’t have to endure periods. You men get raped and murdered significantly less often and you get paid more money for less work.
Oh and as for the gym’s that promote “vagina free” environments like it’s a good thing?
They are GAY gyms dear.
Der.
Hi Craig
I actually made it through the past 24 hours without an argument. Although I don’t make it a habit to argue with people, I could easily have taken that path yesterday. Instead I kept reminding myself to take responsibility for and control my feelings. And I’m so pleased I did just that.
Thanks Craig, I really value this forum.
J9 ()
Cheers Chelle and well down with the lack of argument/s… ( )
Hi Tina – here’s a tip for not losing those long comments: before you click publish, copy the comment so that if it somehow gets lost in cyberspace (as they do) you can simply paste it into another thingy and re-send it.
I’m so technical.
( )
Hi Cdn Friend
So glad you didn’t turn into a man… or I would have to call you Cdn Buddy
Stop making sense Kelvin… you’re freakin’ me out (as Kramer would say)…
“look how many crusty, old, ugly (but rich) men get their hands on pretty young women?”
Now that’s an interesting subject to explore Suz… I’ll let you do it.
As for the ‘How to Operate a Woman’ post… it can only end in tears. For me.
( )
Hi Kitty
I bleat and therefore I am…
And very happy to be an upright wee-er. Especially in a field.
And yes you girls do get the short straw with many things.
( )
Craig, I think its because women are bombarded by pictures of how we are supposed to look and be like that we are so touchy on the body/weight issues.
You never see commericals saying its alright to be pear or apple shaped.
I go to a mixed gym and find what puts me off more is the ladies with gym clothes up their bums ( can I say that) oh and the guys who when you walk past flex their muscles as if to say ‘look at me’.
Yes you can say that Anon…
No arguments, a lot of stress that I was trying to not feel but no arguments. The stress was more related to my 3yo not sleeping due to molars coming through then having to go grocery shopping with her when every man woman and child was out because it was the first day of school hols. 3hours to do what normally takes me 45mins! But NO arguments….lol (does shouting to someone to turn their high beams off count?)
It’s suicide for a male commentator to say such things but what about female about female?
Perhaps the newspaper article written the same but by a female would have had the footy player a little more put off?
Maybe it has more to do with a fatherly, brotherly, matey thing being okay but also the motherly, sisterly, best frienderly thing being okay too.
Girls constantly put themselves down (even if there’s no real reason because if you don’t you seem full of yourself and that’s not lady like- societies thing, not mine) we take the hard news with the good from mothers, sisters and friends who usually use the utmost delicacy but comments good or bad are very common. So clearly females take it (liking it or not) from other females. A guy making comment straight away feels like a put down, a female, objective criticism (well Karlson Kresley falls into that female category too but you won’t get away with that, oh wise one).
You boys do your own thing and we’ll do ours. I would also like to see what you say, but I’m glad you’re not because you will miss the point with everything, you can’t know a womans mind and therefore better to not make any attempt..lol
Have a great day,
CJ
Gee thanks, Craig, but I’m going to use my “get-out-of-his-crusty-old-hands-free” card here … I’m neither pretty enough nor young enough to attract the kind of money it would take to make me succumb to that dynamic!
Still think you should write that article. Never had you pegged as a chicken… ;-P
So funny and so true, this should be sent to Sam Newman. I think he'd love it. Oh & yesterdays post was a beauty. Keep up the brilliant work Dude!
“you can’t know a womans mind”
Such profound wisdom early in the day CJ…
Not scared Suz… smart
Made it through the first 24 hours no problems, but then I think I’ve only spoken to about 3 people in that time (obviously need to leave the house more!)
Good work Liz.
You hermit
Hi Craig.
"copy the comment so that if it somehow gets lost in cyberspace (as they do) you can simply paste it into another thingy and re-send it."
Know what… I just realised that it was actually when I tried to copy it that everything went grey. I did still hit the publish button but alas… it was gone without copying. I learned that trick quite some time ago after losing a very lengthy comment, but now I think maybe I need to type it all up in a .txt and then c&p it into here !
Wow… two comments from me on the one topic… well no… this is a different topic really, isn't it. OK… I'll go before I start an argument with myself. Teehee…
{{HUG}} Tina
Hiya,
Yes, Kelvin – wot you said – is true. Also I reckon that men and women just ARE different, regardless of our society or our conditioning. Before having a son, I think I may have gone with the ‘we condition them to be different’ thought, but honestly he was so vastly different (from my daughter) from such an early age, that I had to change my ideas. I was fascinated by him – from the age of 1, he used to try and ‘fix stuff’ (try and put the loose wheels back on his trike, type thing) whereas little Miss would’ve merely cried and walked away (helplessly).
They continue to fascinate me as I watch them both – one into fast cars and action figures (unprompted and purely from his own interest) the other into hair bows and pretty dresses.
I know I didn’t make this happen – they are just different.
Hope this comment is relevant – I guess also our society does then play on these differences, which then further widens the gap…..
BTW Not sure I’d like a gym with no Tom, Dick’s or Harry’s – not that I’ve noticed any of them (splutter, cough!!) – much.
Have a great day – also so glad you didn’t go the How to Operate a Woman article – I was a bit scared you would!!
Hugs and handshakes (you choose),
Mon ( )
PS No arguements this end of cyberspace in the last 24 hrs – but a little bit of ‘breath holding’ ….that helps, too.
Totally agree Craig, some women are too precious and unfortunately the media can get all excited about something, just because it’s something to write about! Fat is fat as far as I’m concerned. Not only that, if your job is to be an athlete, then comments are going to made about your physiology, as it may affect your performance, the same way that comments would be made about your ability to count to 10 (or lack of) if your job is an accountant.
As for female/male only gyms, I actually get the plus of those – when I first got my mother to a gym, she wouldn’t train in front of men as she felt self conscious, so she joined a gym that had a ‘female only’ area. I think at first you do actually think that EVERYONE is looking at you and judging you, but after a while you realise that everyone actually has better stuff to do (like their own work out) than to look at you. She doesn’t care anymore if she is in the female only part of the gym or not.
No problems not arguing for the first 24 hrs!
I’ll go the hug thanks Mon.
But then I am needy.
And an excellent hugger ( )
Cheers Liz U.
Keep up the non-arguing.
Is that even a term?
Okay, keep up the calm.
Much better
I’m with you – as one of the sensitive females, I’d be devastated if you had have called me fat when I was actually fat. We’ve built up this world of not being able to say it to women without upsetting them. I have no problem (now) with you saying that I’m carrying 3 kilos more body fat than is healthy for my age and other factors, if in fact that is true. But bloody hell it’s taken me ages to be able to cop that kind of feedback on the chin because my default position is to take it as a criticism and then get defensive.
About 5 years ago, my mum had a heart to heart with me, and tried to boost my self confidence by saying “and you’re not fat, you’re fine”. She was trying to make me feel better, but shielding me from the truth, and that I was bloody unhealthy. I weighed 84kg and I’m only 164cm, busting out of size 16 clothes, so it would have been accurate to say that I was fat, or overweight / obese depending on which classification you use.
I still notice this tip-toeing around fat and women today in my family. My family is telling me “you gotta live”, “jam isn’t bad for you”, “eat cheese – a little bit is ok” blah blah blah it won’t make you fat, stop worrying about it so much. It’s a big bucket of denial and I can’t stand it. My sister is currently carrying a few extra kgs and after seeing what she eats on the weekend I know why. She was still giving me eating advice as I ate a salad sandwich and she ate a massive spring roll.
Rant over and off to be productive.
Miss Jojo xx
BOOOOOM! FAILED!!!!!!!
lasted about 6 hours lol.
Will try again today.
and no, I don’t drink Red Bull – I have to stay away from that stuff (and coffee) or I’d *never* shut up!
Okay – let’s try and get through today with NO arguments. I suppose that means I have to stop stirring them up too!?! Very interesting. I LOVE A CHALLENGE! here goes…
vicki g xox
Nice Rant Miss Jojo ( )
Oh Miss Vicki….. 6 hrs!!
See if you can stretch it to seven today…
The inequality you write of may also be due to the fact that there are so many more male commentators given air space in the media, world-wide. And even on the blogosphere. Men are generally (and yes, generalisations are dangerous, but who can get through the day without one, excepting perhaps Aristotle and Plato?) also more prone to adopting the stance of “expert”, and holding forth on chosen subjects.
Not that women lack opinions. Just that, by and large, even the most insightful and informed female commentators tend to also get judged by their looks – consider Michelle Grattan in Melbourne’s Age newspaper. She is possibly the most respected political journalist in the country, but is constantly lampooned for – you guessed it – her looks.
By the by – as far as it being OK for you to comment on a man’s physique and not on a woman’s….You may well find that the reverse is equally true. Women can and do comment on other women’s appearance constantly and humourously and at times, viciously. Can they REALLY comment in the same way about men? How egos would falter! I suspect there would be just as much of an uproar about public lampooning by women of penis sizes and beer guts as there might be about “tits and arse” jokes from men…
It may just be that we are ALL subject to the same kinds of restrictions, and that they are as much to do with manners and sensitivity (or lack thereof) as political correctness. In fact, a certain amount of “correctness” is little more than an attempt to restore something as old-fashioned and useful as manners…
This essay continues at PC.com!
Thanks for your thoughts Anon – you make almost too much sense
Cheers.
So Craig, your ad for the men only gym, “No Betty’s, No Mary’s, and definitely no Fanny’s” didn’t make it to the billboard stage then?
Gb
No Gb – but it should have!
Cheers
Hi, Just thought I would mention that when Fernwood started up they were taken to court, and they won, I think it was on the basis that there were gyms generally available. There are also legally men only clubs and men only gay pubs in Melbourne.
Personally if access to a service is available somewhere, I don’t have a problem with some segregated services.
There was also the case of the hairdresser who was taken to court for charging women more for the same haircut. As men have longer hair now it was possible to show it was the same haircut.
I think the commenting on female appearance issue has more to do with women being perceived as more valuable if attractive. I waswatching a radio host being interviewed who said she was astonished at the number of callers who told her she was ugly when they disagreed with her, even thought they couldn’t see her. Somehow discrediting her appearance in their minds discredited her opinion.
Cheers
With the risk of a barrage of derision I will add this.
I have had the opinion for quite some time that White, Hetero, Anglo males are the most oppressed group of people in this country. Every other group has their own individual laws.
If I say something against women I am sexist
if i say something against Gays I am homophobic.
If i say something against blacks I am racist.
I can’t win, even if what I am saying is a logical balanced argument.
Thanks for sharing your thoughts Kay..
No derision from me Terry.
Thanks for dropping by..
A touch of derision here, Terry, but applied with a gentle hand…
Try offering your opinion to a refugee from Afghanistan (of either sex). Or a battered wife. I feel for the oppression of the white Anglo male – but only a very little.
“Logic and balance” aren’t always the only options – unless of course, you want to “win,” as you write. Compassion and empathy serve us well too.
Ahh, Kelvin beat me to it. Completely agree.
That’s why I’m so glad that there’s plenty of outliers here at the far end of the bell curve, keeping you all on your toes! We freaks are here to stay XD